Obama Slams GOP "Jobs Bill"

Yes, but how are they going to spin the following into actual jobs:

It turns out the Republican plan boils down to a few basic ideas: They want to gut regulations; they want to let Wall Street do whatever it wants. They want to drill more. And they want to repeal health care reform. That’s their jobs plan.”

The only thing the GOP has advocated locally or nationally is more lay offs. that is the entirety of their jobs plan.

facts ...some for you,

from Senate.cop.gov, or the Congressional Oversight Panel.

http://www.senate.gov/general/search/search_cfm.cfm?q=financial+deregulation&site=default_collection&num=10&filter=0

what the 'financial deregulation' policies accomplished in this country,

during republican's time in Washington.

Sometimes, I really hate the GOP.

Why, Mike? Because you're insulted that they would assume we're all as stupid as the morons who actually lap up their thoughtless swill? Or that we're stupid enough to believe their fact-free nonsense? Or that they'd rather lie than tell the truth ("so we're employed, you're not and we don't care! More lemonade, Mr. Koch?")? Or that we must admit that the GOTP messaging machine trumps the real needs and aspirations of most Americans? Or that they'll continue to get away with their farce until we have fewer "low-information voters" in the electorate?

Yes.

Mr. President, with all due respect, facts do not play very well in American politics.

How so very unfortunately, true.

I truly wish Democrats were better at translating the facts into words that touched the emotions of Americans.

Democrats are just too damned polite. When the Rethugs throw feces, Dems don't fight back. They just stand there, look at the thugs, calmly wipe off the mess and try to reason with them.

You can't reason with thugs - or Rethugs.

a new line for Ingsoc -- "Lay-offs are growth." #Orwell1984

Sebbydad

#2- I tend to disagree with that statement, I say, facts do not play well with republicans...

Obama has lied about everything he has done since he has been in office. The country is in terrible condition due to his policie's, one scandal and crooked deal after another and you still follow him. I feel sorry for you guy's.

At #2.12

December 2010 -- Economy growing at 3% adding 250,000 jobs.

Now, ten months after Republicans take control of the House of Representatives -- Economy STALLED

I'm sorry son, it's pretty clear to a lot of us where the trouble is.

It turns out the Republican plan boils down to a few basic ideas: They want to gut regulations; they want to let Wall Street do whatever it wants. They want to drill more. And they want to repeal health care reform. That’s their jobs plan.”

That's not a jobs bill, that a regurgitation of all of the sickening Republican dogmas.

How about a pay as you go plan? Republicans need to pay back taxpayers for all of the wasted time and money that went into this ridiculous insincere proposal. We need to vote them out of their jobs!

Boy, call me a fool but it seem's our unempoyment rate is terrible, there are more people on foodstamp's than ever and Obama give's 500+million dollars to exec's at Solyndra who new they would go bankrupt before the construction of the company even started. Hell, there's only 312 million people in the U.S. which mean's he could have given every man, woman and child in the U.S. 1.5 million dollar's. Think anyone would have bought some car's, house's, clothe's, food? Go ahead let Obama keep spending your money for you. If you had a brain youd be mad as hell, and I am most definitely not your son, but you are a sheep being brought to the slaughter.

Obama has lied about everything he has done since he has been in office. The country is in terrible condition due to his policie's, one scandal and crooked deal after another and you still follow him. I feel sorry for you guy's.

i feel sorry for you, and the delusional un-reality you live in.

no, actually i take that back; i think you choose to live there, and if you don't, i think it's because you failed to educate yourself so as to think critically. instead i feel sorry for your English teacher.

Hell, there's only 312 million people in the U.S. which mean's he could have given every man, woman and child in the U.S. 1.5 million dollar's

I think your math is a little off.

You want to compare bad investments, how about the Iraq war, which was originally going to cost an estimated $50 billion to $60 billion and would be re-payed with proceeds from Iraqi oil...now estimated to be as high as $3 trillion, only about 6,000 times larger than Solyndra.

And oil prices went from $25 a barrel at the start of the Iraq war, went to $140 a barrel in 2008 (which helped put the country in recession) to their current $86 a barrel. It's clear that that investment paid off, just not for the American people.

Math is math and changing the subject doesn't change the fact's. Why are they refusing to release the Solyndra document's if there wasn't something to hide. So much for a transparent administration. Obama is no more looking out for the little guy than the man in the moon but you can alway's keep hoping.

Yes, math is math. $500,000,000 / 312,000,000 = $1.60

$3,000,000,000,000 / 312,000,000 = $9,615.39

And yours is terrible. You only proved my point Yes 1.6 million dollar's a piece not 1.60. You must have learned your math from Obama. Look if the amount were only 312 million to Solyndra and there are 312 million people to keep it simple for you that would be a million a piece. Just a fact but I guess it doesn't make you mad and apparently you think he's doing a great job. I just think your not really being honest with yourself.

Look if the amount were only 312 million to Solyndra and there are 312 million people to keep it simple for you that would be a million a piece.

Why don't you re-read what you just wrote a couple of times, maybe a light bulb will go on in there somewhere eventually.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/09/13/317700/poll-americans-prefer-obamas-jobs-plan-over-gops/POLL: AMERICANS PREFER OBAMA’S JOBS PLAN TO GOP’S | A United Technologies/National Journal Congressional Connection Poll finds that Americans prefer the proposals President Obama offered last week to boost employment over “competing ideas advanced by congressional Republicans and the GOP’s 2012 presidential field.” Although respondents had doubts about both agendas, nearly half of those surveyed believed Obama’s plan would help somewhat. When it came to who they trust more to revive the economy, Obama held a 37 percent to 35 percent advantage over congressional Republicans. As the National Journal graphic below illustrates, the survey asked respondents to weigh in on specific policy proposals offered by the GOP or President Obama. Four of the five most popular proposals were Obama’s:

MW - "Sometimes, I really hate the GOP."

'k....so....I'll take the rest of your 'sometimes' and add it to my 'pretty much' hate the GOP and that should give me a fairly good start with in the hate that direction.

Do they serve fries with that? ??

Look to put it even more simply 312 million is 312 million and if you can't see that then you have problem's that can't be helped. How are you able to get on a computer?

Gee a democratic poll that show's a slight favor to Obama's no job's bill. Surely you can do better than that!

poor-sheeple, there is something seriously wrong with your math, so we'll move past that. Obama is small fry compared to Bush. Obama could have 1000 Solyndra's, and still come up short by 6 times from the waste of Bush.

Gee a democratic poll that show's a slight favor to Obama's no job's bill. Surely you can do better than that!

In contrast to Fox relying on phone in / internet polls of its viewers and Rasmusson, who - strangely enough - always gives Murdoch and Fox exactly the results they want.

Boy, call me a fool.....

OK.

You're a fool.

We aim to please!

It turns out the Republican plan boils down to a few basic ideas:

They want to gut regulations; over regulating is costing 10's of 1,000's of jobs. The EPA has gone wild and now they are regulating DUST. Are you kidding me? Some regulation is necessary for clean air and water, but the amount of regulations we have now are strangling small businesses. THAT is why we have no jobs.

they want to let Wall Street do whatever it wants. No, they don't. Stop taking it to the extreme. They want to lighten up some regulations that make no sense and hurt job creation.

They want to drill more. The moratorium on drilling in the gulf has killed 1,000's upon 1,000's of jobs. Beside providing us with cheaper fuel which brings down costs for businesses, more drilling would open up 10's of 1,000's of jobs immediately. We CAN drill with the technology we have now without hurting the environment.

And they want to repeal health care reform. That’s their jobs plan.” This crummy plan that does nothing to make sure people have healthcare and does nothing to reduce the deficit or create jobs, must go. It is a job killer. There are many many companies who will not hire while they don't know what their future costs will be for healthcare.

Sounds like all of these things would create jobs almost immediately. So why doesn't our President want you all to have jobs?

How would these things create jobs immediately?

regulations are not the determining factor for hiring - DEMAND is.

Is there a shortage of brokers, hedge fund managers and investment company executives that we are unaware of? There appears to be no shortage of money on Wall Street as they are bringing in record profits. How, specifically, are regulations on wall street preventing jobs?

There are more leases and drilling than ever before - more drilling does not equal lower oil costs - oil prices are not set by supply nor demand. Drilling without hurting the environment - have there been significant advancements in drilling technology since deepwater horizon?

yeah, just because my son is still covered under my work policy after he turned 18 when he otherwise wouldn't be. My sister is finally able to get coverage despite a pre-existing condition, I guess they are the only two people in the country who benefited from the ACA. CBO still scores it as reducing the deficit and as it puts Billions into the insurance industry and increases demand for medical care, it would seem to me that it creates jobs. Further - businesses don't know what their future costs for health care will be now - their providers jack up prices annually while usually reducing coverage.

The repubs jobs plan looks exactly like bush's plan.

The repubs jobs plan looks exactly like bush's plan

The GOP of the 21st Century Talking points havent changed much.

facts ...some for you,

from Senate.cop.gov, or the Congressional Oversight Panel.

http://www.senate.gov/general/search/search_cfm.cfm?q=financial+deregulation&site=default_collection&num=10&filter=0

what the 'financial deregulation' policies accomplished in this country,

during republican's time in Washington.

Geez, wasn't Barney Franke the ranking member on the Financial Services Committee?

in 1999 um no. Beginning in 2007 - yes. Does he get to dictate policy -no.

Congress doesn't have anything to do with policy? Why is everyone disappointed in them then?

100 percent of Republicans in the Senate voted against it. That doesn’t make any sense, does it?”

And eighty percent of Democrats voted against it. I think that brings it into the venue of a bad bill doesn't it?

felicitie,

i think you took a wrong turn at google. this is the Democrats are the greatest and republicans stink website.

What better place to add a little reality? This is where it's needed most.

:)

Felicitie exactly what are you referring to that you are claiming 100% of republicans and 80% of democrats have voted against?

It is very hard for me to think of any issue where 100% of republicans and 80% of democrats voted against it. Would a democrat propose a bill like that???

I await with baited breath for Felicitie's explanation.

Perhaps not eighty percent but certainly not enough enthusiasm in the democratic party by a large margin to pass the bill :

There are some senators who are up for election who say I’m never gonna vote for a tax increase while I’m up for election, even on the wealthiest people. So, we’re not gonna have 100 percent Democratic senators,” he told WLS radio. “That’s why it needs to be bipartisan and I hope we can find some Republicans who will join us to make it happen.”

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/10/05/obama-s-jobs-bill-vote-blocked-by-reid-over-lack-of-democratic-support.html

Actually the bill did have a majority in order to be brought for debate, it was the GOP that then filibustered to keep it from actually being debated on the floor. Thank you for admitting that you lied earlier. I'm sorry the GOP speak is that "you did not mean that as a factual statement". isn't that how it goes?

Of course they are willing to bring it up for debate because they know it will never pass in its current form because so many Democrats aren't going to vote to pass it.

The only two dems that didn't vote for it only object to ending the oil subsidies because they come from oil producing states. the GOP filibustered and required 60 votes to bring the measure to the floor. even if every Dem had voted for it, the GOP was NEVER going to allow this bill to be discussed and debated because they know that any improvement to the economy gives them nothing to campaign on.

I repeat, it was a vote to bring the bill to the floor. IF the bill had come to the floor for a vote, many, many, many democrats would have voted it down. THAT is why Reid is sitting on it.

It was a vote to bring it to the floor and Ried was leading that charge to get it to the floor and had a majority of senators on board with bringing it to the floor, the McConnell b;locked it from coming to the floor.

We have already established that you will make non factual statements regarding what democratic senators would or would not do. Please refrain from continuing to do so.

Sebbydad,

The fact remains that many democrats would vote against adopting the bill. Harry Reid knows that and you know that. Bring it up for a vote today? Nah.

I appreciate that you have gone from your unsupported 80% to just saying 'many' which is also unsupported. The facts are that a majority of the senate voted to discuss the bill (which is where changes and amendments that make bills more palatable occur) It was the GOP that stopped that discussion cold.

The fact remains that many democrats would vote against adopting the bill.

Could provide some rational explanation how how you imagine to know such an alleged fact?

So long as you allege this is a "fact" how many is many? YOu are certain that many who voted to bring the bill to a vote would in "fact" vote against it if the GOP dropped their fillibuster?

If this is a "fact" then why didnt the GOP drop their fillibuster and go to an immediate vote? If you are correct than that a losing vote would be EXACTLY what the GOP wanted. Do you imagine you know more about the facts and votes than the GOP leadership?

Do you believe that it is verified fact, or are you possibly confusing your strong hunch or supsicion with the word "fact."

yes gentlemen ... thank you for stating what should be obvious to most GOTP'ers as well ....

Man you people have short memorie's. What exactly have any of Obama's plan done but bankrupt the country, create no jobs and stall the economy. Maybe you should actually read Obama's job's bill and see what it doe's. If your not a teacher, police, fireman or union worker your out of luck. Amazing. Oh well drink some more of that kool aid while you can still get it and maybe build an altar to Obama and sacrifice yourselve's to him. Gee's WAKE UP!

So it took republicans how long to come out with a plan? A plan that some economist say may cost jobs in the long run and if you read it (I have) it is the same old same old. So stir the sugar laced kool-aid conservatives and realize they are pulling that wool back over your eyes.

At first I wasn't sure but one look at your home page and your screen name sinched it. Paid re-reg troll whose only job is to post lies.

Wake up call before you go away to re-reg another day. GWB signed the tax reward program for outsourcing. Obama stopped the Recession he created. The Hosue was handed to the GOP/Tea party and the job grothw while slow came to an abrut end because of it. NV is for people who think and the only sheeple here is you (sorry but you can't call that an attack because after all IT'S YOUR SCREEN NAME.

No my screen name is poor-sheeple referring to you poor misguided soul's that refuse to see the overwhelmingly OBVIOUS truth. You can say that water isn't wet but that doesn't change the fact and judging from your wimpy, pathetic attempts to undermine other's and shut them up , I'd say your soaking wet. Sorry!

Learn to spell, pull your pant's up don't even think about trying to rap for a living.

Doing the same thing expecting a different result is not smart. 30 years of tax cutting has gotten us here. If the only thing driving your party loyalty is adherence to tax cuts, you have no idea what governing is all about. Bush's tax cuts were the result of a budget surplus, that he inherited from Clinton. So his tax cut was paid for by the Clinton surplus. When the wars started, and Medicare Part D was passed, Bush did not institute a tax to pay for them. The result is what we have now. The Repubs 'borrow and spend' from Reagan is a disaster that most people knew instinctively, called 'voodoo economics'. It's past time to pay the bills, and that means higher taxes.

sheeple - I'm usually not one to be a grammar gestapo.

But for the love of all things holy... learn how to properly use an apostrophe. Plural words (not word's) do not need an apostrophe. I hope you have a job and haven't had to write your own resume. It makes you look super dumb (not saying you are)

You use an apostrophe to note possession... like "Chad's bike (the bike of chad)" or "A country's flag (flag of a country)"

You get it right here (except for verb disagreement):

What exactly have any of Obama's plan done but bankrupt the country

(plans belonging to Obama)

But incorrect here:

maybe build an altar to Obama and sacrifice yourselve's to him

Apostrophes are also used in contractions. But that doesn't seem to be your weak point.

The country is going bankrupt and its all Obama's fault is a pure low IQ Tea Potty talking point.

What Tey Won't Tell You About The National Debt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1bZ-TiX8rA

Reagan and the two Bushes account for $9.2 trillion of the national debt, over $11 trillion with interest added in. That's 77 percent of the entire national debt from just three Republican presidents coving 5 terms in office.

George W Bush nearly doubled the national debt mostly by re establishing tax cuts to the rich while starting two unfunded multi trillion dollar quagmires in the Mideast. Boehner, McConnell, Cantor and other veteran GOP legislators were all there to eagerly vote for Bush's spending binge. Then they voted 7 times in the House and 7 times in the Senate to raise the debt ceiling with no serious concerns expressed. Back then, Cheney said "deficits don't count."

Then suddenly they do when we elected a Democrat into the White House. That's hypocrisy.

poor-sheeple is a perfect example of the type of people that would vote for the tea party.

sheeple

Never claimed to be a rapper and never wanted to be one. What I am is a person who tells it like it is and I use the truth instead of the BULLSH!T you use to spin, lie, and twist in the wind. In short your worse nightmare because I can rip apart all your lies and post a link from a non-bias source to back it.

So tell you what. From now on it's time to post with proof. Don't make a clam without backing it with an un-bias source. So lets go all or nothing. I'll show mine if you show me yours. Well see whose telling the truth and who is full of sh!t.

Start with your next reply and if you can't place a link then don't post at all. I'm daring you to back any claim you've made so far.

i"m sure all the dems pay their on way eh?

I wonder if Cantor and the young guns are 'truly' independent entities and choose to pay for their own healthcare and benefits. Or are they content to live off the public dole like those parasites they demogogue about.

Cantor Promises Oil Speculators That GOP Will Block Financial Regulations
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcXJR7eZ_jQ

Cantor doesn't serve the American people, he serves Wall Street.

...it's not real - like his birth certificate...

You DO remember that this little meme didn't work out so well for all of you?

It's their code. They only count their supporters as Americans. They've been doing this for years, but as a concerted effort since Obama was elected.

"The key point is that ever since the Reagan years, the Republican Party has been dominated by radicals - ideologues and/or apparatchiks who, at a fundamental level, do not accept anyone else's right to govern."-- Paul Krugman, "The Politics of Spite,"

and who was it that said our President was weak? ... perhaps he was too busy trying to help Americans and our nation to take the time to put his gloves on and get into spitball fights ... but now is the time to kick ass for the sake of all of us ... and we've got your back Mr. President!

It's their code. They only count their supporters as Americans.

a variation on the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.

Yea Coral but he don't have your's!

Apparently dems don't have memorie's when it comes to there own failings.

skeptic-227981 Great post!!!

bush wasted 3 trillion dollars in Iraq. The economy lost 14 trillion dollars in his watch.
poor-sheeple Did you vote for bush twice??

http://news.antiwar.com/2011/06/29/study-us-wars-cost-4-trillion-killed-258000/
Study: US Wars Cost $4 Trillion, Killed 258,000................137,000 Civilians 'Directly' Killed in Iraq, Afghanistanby Jason Ditz, June 29, 2011Email This | Print This | Share This | Antiwar ForumA new study from Brown University’s Watson Institute has set an estimated that the post 9/11 costs
of the assorted wars of the Bush and Obama Administrations has been in the realm of $4 trillion and
has directly killed 258,000 people.
If this death toll seems a tad low, its because it is. The study readily admits that it is only
calculating “direct” kills, and not the indirect deaths from shoddy healthcare, lack of access to
food and water, etc in the various occupied nations.
The toll includes 137,000 civilians directly killed in Afghanistan and Iraq and notes that there are
no reliable figures for the number of civilians killed in Pakistan, but says 35,000 more there is a
conservative estimate.

The word 'real' is code for 'us only'. We figured that out a long time ago. It's passive-aggressive. They are really good at cultural manipulation, and I feel sorry for the sheep that follow them, totally oblivious to the fact they are being played.

Just to be clear, some Americans are realizing cutting jobs does not improve the economy.

The repub leaders are smart enough to get all those moron voters to vote for them and against their own self interests.

They say it because they cannot take the chance of even more public support for a jobs bill. If unemployment drops be even a single percentage point between now and next November Obama walks away with a win.

Can it get any worse??? I'd vote for Jimmy Carter over this president..and that isnt saying much. We are leaderless !!

At #10.2 -- Oh you mean you would vote for the only President in the modern era not to involve US Troops someplace?

You would vote for the President who began what became the Stealth fighter and bomber programs?

I love how the dim witted mock what they don't want to be bothered to learn, I really do.

They can call it campaigning if they like, but the truth is this:

For the first time in his presidency, Obama is finally throwing some punches of his own. He took this to the public - and he's right to do so. It pisses off the Repubbies, and that is just too bad. He's making an end run around Fox and the right-wing radio klub and that has to be frustrating. What a shame.

As for campaigning? The Repugs started their 2012 campaign on 1/20/09 and they have thrown everything including the kitchen sink at Obama. Pathetic loser whiners can dish it out but they can't take it - at all.

I don't understand why the Republicans say that obama is campaigning. He isn't.

because they're attempting to imply that his comments are just empty rhetoric, of course. surprising thing is tho -- to borrow a sports metaphor -- often times the best campaigning is good governing.

Obama IS campaigning. So what? They've been campaining against him for 3 years now, and against the American people for 30. It's time he came out swinging, naming names, and calling their crap. And what are they doing. Crying like the babies they are. They've had a free-ride up til now, calling him everything they could think of, stonewalling his policies to nullify his election, and lining up to promise to repeal everything he's passed. It's about time Obama got his campaign on, because 'working with the republicans' has not worked.

The Republicans would say anything untrue about anyone, even their own Mother, if they thought it would help them win an election.

Just like insane John McCain making such a big deal on the Senate Floor about Obama using a Canadian built bus on his tour. The same kind of bus made by the same Canadian company that McCain himself used on his 2008 run for President campaign. The man is so full of hate for Obama that he can't even think straight. He has totally sunk to the bottom of the Fool pool.

The Republicans are so obsessed with power, so full of hate of anything and everyone that does not agree with them, and so totally under the control of the Koch Brothers that they can't think a simple intelligent thought for themselves. And the Koch Brothers are sure not going to allow them to think, say or do anything good for America or its people.

And they are too blind to see what is clearly obvious to the majority of intelligent life forms on earth. They are totally dip sh!t crazy!

They've been campaining against him for 3 years now,

Yep, ever time they said "Obama and his failed policies" they were engaging in campaigning against him. Now they are doing it as they and he are announced candidates. Obama has been restrained up to recently, but it is clear he has a bag of @!$%# with Republicans name on it.

Candidates campaign. Now the contest is fully engaged. Don't complain that you now have an opponent shooting back at you, just deal with it.

time to walk the walk and stop all the "sharing the blame" baloney ... I can understand why the GOTP wants to share half of the crap they put out .... when they deserve all of the blame for the condition this nation is in ... and to make it even worse do nothing to help fix it!

You don't want permanent or even long term government jobs, prime the pump to be sure, build the infrastructure so business can take advantage and expand.

Weaver,

number 1.. Increased taxes...definite job killer....no further explanation needed I would think.

Number 3 targeted exemptions...again a job killer and also...it's not the government's job to use the TX code to modify behavior.

I misspoke...number two is OK....My bad.

Regards,

Mike

At #13 and #13.2 --

100% HORSE@!$%#.

It's the Government's job to "Ensure the domestic tranquility". Sitting on their asses preaching about "the right kind of jobs" is NOT ensuring anything but partisan chaos.

It's also bunk (not that you said this directly, but I've heard others say it) that "the founder's were for free-market!" - THE SECOND LAW PASSED BY THE FIRST UNITED STATES CONGRESS WAS A @!$%#ING TARIFF ON IMPORTED GOOD.

It's the job of Congress (and to extent, the President) to ensure the stability of the United States of America. That means it's their job to do anything they @!$%#ing have to do to ensure the country is safe (speaking of the Military), ensure the economy is strong, and ensure rights are protected -- AND THEY ARE REQUIRED TO PASS LAWS IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE THOSE GOALS (such as spending bills, etc.)

Not only are they not Constitutionally allowed to simply declare something undo-able because it conflicts with their delicate sensibilities, IT IS DAMN NEAR TREASONOUS TO DO SO.

Now before the right-wing whining starts I said "damn near" not specifically that it is prosecutable an act of treason.

If that means Democrats have to pass tax-cuts, so be it (as they did under Reagan and Nixon). If that means Republicans have to pass tax-increases, then SO BE IT.

They are not allowed by the Constitution to have any "morals" outside of ensuring strength and stability of the United States of America.

These "job creators" are raking in billions. They have had the luxury of lower taxes for over a decade. Wall Street got unregulated and they created a global financial meltdown and some people think that taxing them even less and deregulating even more are going to help create jobs????

If they can't create jobs in their current condition then they deserve to fail. I didn't realize it was the government's job to make it easier for them to do business. It should be their job to do business within the laws of our government. The government should not be making laws to accomodate their every whim.

Giving them what they want has done nothing but make them spoiled babies and enabled them to rob tax payers blind. And we have any reason to trust that they'll do the right thing if we'll just bend over a little more??

This would be the same thing as some ignorant woman who dates a serial criminal and then has the gall to act surprised when the guy molests her kid.

May as well get the Gacy clown to babysit your kids.

Penalize those who outsource jobs with higher taxes. And tax the crap out of anything they import from another country. If they are going to continue to accept subsidies while outsourcing jobs they deserved to be penalized not coddled.

Mike

You know, if you have studied any history in this country, that taxes do not ever hurt job creation. In fact, the opposite is true from a historical perspective. When taxes have been higher, the businessman has always had an incentive to plow money back into his or her business, where it was safe from a tax rate. The business was taxed at a somewhat lower rate than the individual. When taxes were above 50%, job growth has always been at its highest. When taxes have been low, as they are now, job growth has been stagnant or negative. The argument about taxes and jobs is just a canard of the right which is absolutely repudiated by the facts of history.

MJ,

Most of what you said is correct...with one major constraint...all those pesky little details in the rest of the constitution, especially the Bill of Rights.

One major impediment to the domestic tranquility is our behemoth government that's spending itself into oblivion. Back of the envelope calculations show that the budget could be balanced just by eliminating the unconstitutional parts of the budget, such as welfare, HUD, the Department of Education and the like.

I won't get into the "perpetual motion machine" concept that says government spending is a plus for the economy.

Regards,

Mike

Eris,

Regarding subsidies.. I agree....no business should be subsidized.

The rest of your post however shows a totally immoral belief that the fruits of someone's labor inherently belong to the community....Phrases such as, "...the luxury of lower taxes..." and "...if they can't create jobs in their current condition then they deserve to fail..." just show a total lack of understanding of economics.

If folks want jobs to return then they will have to rid themselves of childish terms such as "corporate greed" and "obscene profits." Businesses are in business for one reason, to make as much profit as possible for their owners/shareholders...PERIOD. failure to understand and graciously accept that results in jobs going overseas along with the profits...and oh yeah... The tax base.

Regards,

Mike

At #13.6 and #13.7 -- That's a child's like naive understanding of the world.

The United States experienced, BY FAR, it's highest growth when the top Income Tax rate was above 50%. The reason was because there was a super-simple way to avoid paying it -- INVEST IN YOUR BUSINESS.

Income Taxes are exactly that, TAXES ON INCOME -- "bills" aren't income (and aren't taxes, unless you have a completely incompetent tax preparer), EMPLOYEES aren't income, and therefore their salaries are considered expenses and are not subject to tax (again, unless you have a completely incompetent tax preparer).

The problem we have now are lazy people who continually want more and more while paying less and less. They want an ever bigger military industrial complex, they want ever lower taxes. They want Socialists Security and Medicare, they want ever lower taxes. They want an ever growing economy, they want ever lower taxes.

I'm sorry son, just doesn't work that way.

Ever notice how a repub talking point is so short and simple, but the rebuttal takes an entire page. So sometimes you just dismiss their drivel for what it is: a straw-man, demogoguery, or just outright lies.

Ever notice how a repub talking point is so short and simple, but the rebuttal takes an entire page. So sometimes you just dismiss their drivel for what it is: a straw-man, demogoguery, or just outright lies.

Or perhaps, the truth, really is simple and the long explanations are really an attempt to obscure it....Kinda like when you catch your kid w/chocolate smeared around his mouth.

Parent: did you eat the cookies?

Kid: No Daddy

P: What's that around your mouth?

K: I dunno

P: it's chocolate

P: how did the chocolate get smeared on your face.

K: well, I was making the bed like you told me and then the dinosaur came in the window and as I was fighting him off the space alien came upstairs and then I fell down and then there was chocolate all over my face.

And that is how raising taxes will provide jobs.

Regards,

Mike

Or perhaps, the truth, really is simple and the long explanations are really an attempt to obscure it...

Or perhaps, the real world is rarely ever as black and white as the pithy one-line talking points that pass for intellectual debate on the right tries to paint it. The facts are often more nuanced.

@Mike

No one has an issue with corporations looking out for their bottom line. But people have a right to look after their own bottom line. As it stands tax payers are heavily invested in these obnoxious giants. We deserve a return on our investment.

We have a right to our own bottom line - so sayeth capitalism. We have a right to fair pay for our work just as so many think they deserve these obscene (and they are) bonuses. These people fail and still get this money and people defend them as having earned it! Yet a guy who busts his ass 50 hours a week should just shut up and be glad he gets his pittance.

I just find it odd that people who support capitalism claim that wage earners are greedy for wanting the same thing as a corporation even though they make much less. It's hypocritical and that is being polite.

Money needs to be removed from our government. Corporations have no business having so much say in our government and they have not earned the right to be trusted. They have proven that nothing we do will encourage them to bring back jobs unless we force our own people to work for $2.00 a day and let them pollute our drinking water. I see no reason to give them another thing. As far as most of us are concerned they can take their toys and shove them.

I do have an objection to corporations taking out life insurance policies on staff in order to increase profits. I have a problem with corps that sell off pension funds during 'restructuring'. I have a huge problem with businesses that are lobbying for less regulation and lower taxes while hoarding cash in offshore accounts and skirting regulations that put our safety economy and environment at risk.

We need to train more people to work as CEOs, the CEOs need a lot more competition.

The first act that this President and both houses of congress should do is to strengthen the government both financially and economically.

Marcel?????? Are you a communist? Because this is truly a Socialist/Marxist/Communist statement.

Also what is the difference between financially and economically?

The I guess your beloved Perry is a COMMUNIST because he claims to know how to create jobs and we should follow his example in Texas. Oh wait the only jobs he created where with the stimulus money and they where all GOVERNMENT JOBS.

Pot meet Kettle your a frigging Commie.

Code pink,

Financially, meant to me that the government have enough funds (money) to conduct it's business of taking care of all Americans. No government can take care of all it's people but as long as it is financially stable it could provide services for those who is in dire straits.

Economically to me meant that the government is not just stable with enough money to spend to function properly but that the people under it's care is also financially stable. This means they got jobs. Businesses are financially stable and is not losing money. I don't mean the Stock Market, I mean businesses like manufacturing, service industries, petro-chemical and all other kind of business ventures that is actually existing, producing and selling products, paying working employees and not paper companies that exist mostly on papers but producing profit because stockholders are playing the market.

I am not a communist because I believe strictly on giving people salary increase base on merits not based on whom they know, how long they are working on the job or their certificate of educational attainment. I believe that people who are lazy should not get an increase in salary and that performance must not be only based on how much they can produce over the other fellows but on how much they have contributed to the company's profit margin due to progressive methods improvement ideas, etc.

Perry is a COMMUNIST because he claims to know how to create jobs and we should follow his example in Texas. Oh wait the only jobs he created where with the stimulus money and they where all GOVERNMENT JOBS.

From Politifact:

We turned to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the official federal source of employment data for the nation, states and localities. We looked at government job growth during Perry’s tenure, from January 2001 to July 2011:

State government jobs: Increase of 49,100, or about 4,600 per year of Perry’s tenure
Local government jobs: Increase of 217,600, or about 20,700 per year
Federal government jobs: Increase of 19,700, or about 1,900 per year

Total government jobs: Increase of 286,400, or about 27,300 per year

Meanwhile, Texas employment overall increased over this period by 1,078,600, or about 102,700 per year.

Healthcare jobs. Texas: up 12.6 percent.

Private education jobs. Texas: Up 17.4 percent.

Oil and gas jobs. Texas: Up 6.7 percent.

Retail jobs. Texas: Up 1.9 percent.

What sets Texas apart is that it is "the only large labor market state in the nation that's shown a positive growth in private-sector jobs," said Tom Pauken, chairman of the Texas Workforce Commission. Perry took office at the end of 2000, and since 2001 the nation as a whole has had a net loss of private-sector jobs, while Texas had a net gain of 825,400 private-sector jobs.

The fastest-growing industry in Texas is mining and logging, which grew by 19.4 percent, or 40,500 net jobs, over the last year. Rising energy demand, along with discoveries of natural gas in shale formations across Texas, have resulted in the expansion of hydraulic fracturing and offshore drilling operations, both environmentally controversial practices.

Energy extraction flourishes in Texas because of the "low taxes and low regulations," said Bill Peacock, the director of the conservative Texas Public Policy Foundation's economic center. Peacock said states cannot match Texas' success because those with resources have often prohibited offshore drilling or increased regulations on hydraulic fracturing.

Perry has little influence over local government jobs and NO influence over federal jobs!

Pot and Kettle meet the bottom of my foot!

Financially, meant to me that the government have enough funds (money)

Economically to me meant that the government is not just stable with enough money to spend to function properly but that the people under it's care is also financially stable.

Marcel........ Strengthening the Government both financially (With money) and economically ( with the means of production, the peoples labor, capital, and property) is communism. Socialist Marxism is Communism. I'm sorry if I offended you but ........ MY FATHER AND UNCLE BOTH DIED FIGHTING FOR FREEDOM AGAINST COMMUNISM!

I am not a communist because I believe strictly on giving people salary increase base on merits not based on whom they know, how long they are working on the job or their certificate of educational attainment. I believe that people who are lazy should not get an increase in salary and that performance must not be only based on how much they can produce over the other fellows but on how much they have contributed to the company's profit margin due to progressive methods improvement ideas, etc.

So you are anti-union...... I am with you there. But a "strengthened government" empowered to financially and economically "provide (care) for the people takes away their freedom and thus we become the USSA.

LOL

You went and included every year just to C.Y.A. while ignoring the point. You just skipped right over Jobs Created in Texas with Stimulus funding.

Perry’s ‘Pay-to-Play’ Job-Incentive Funds Miss Targets in Texas

bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-01/perry-s-pay-to-play-job-incentive-funds-miss-targets-in-texas.html

Perry says stimulus didn’t create jobs; CBO says it did

reuters.com/frontrow/2011/09/12/perry-says-stimulus-didnt-create-jobs-cbo-says-it-did/

And the last for now but not the end:

How Rick Perry Created Jobs in Texas

usnews.com/news/blogs/rick-newman/2011/08/16/how-rick-perry-created-jobs-in-texas

Federal government jobs. Texas: Up 7 percent. U.S.: Up 4.3 percent. Nationwide, the federal government has been a steady source of job growth over the last three years, and Texas has gotten more than its share, thanks to several big Army bases and a heavy NASA presence. Texas is one of the biggest beneficiaries of Washington spending, which pumps more than $200 billion per year into the state economy, according to the New York Times. That reliance on federal money could backfire if there are cutbacks in military and space spending in coming years, as many analysts expect.

State government jobs. Texas: Up 8.4 percent. U.S.: Down 0.1 percent.

Local government jobs. Texas: Up 6.1 percent. U.S.: Down 1.7 percent.

Opps! Any questions?

by Tony Wlliams

the only jobs he created where with the stimulus money and they where all GOVERNMENT JOBS.

LOL False!

Lets just look at last year.

STATE-BY-STATE PRIVATE-SECTOR EMPLOYMENT

The following chart shows the private-sector employment trends between 2001 and 2011, as well as the one-year changes from 2010 to 2011.The following chart shows the private-sector employment trends between 2001 and 2011, as well as the one-year changes from 2010 to 2011.

StatePrivate-sector jobs (April 2001)Private-sector jobs (April 2010)Private-sector jobs (April 2011)10-year raw changeRank1-year raw changeRank

Texas
7,946,200
8,427,300
8,679,000
732,800
1
251,700
1

Texas avoided the real-estate bust that decimated the economies of several large Sunbelt states, including California and Florida, during the 2008-2010 recession. It consequently was positioned for a faster takeoff once the national economy began improving, allowing it to create 251,700 new jobs in the past year alone.

I guess spending taxpayer dollars on private sector job creation is somehow a socialist move. Better to spend on democratic failures like green jobs and high speed rail.

Opps! Any questions?

Yeah I got 3!

How come your using 9 years when the stimulus is only for last year?

Are you avoiding what he did with the money on purpose!

You also avoided the fact that he has been creating more Government jobs than the entire Nation as a whole so what's up with that?

Texas has used $17.4 billion in federal stimulus money — including $8 billion of the one-time dollars to fund state expenses that recur over and over. In fact, Texas used the federal stimulus to balance its last two budgets.

How come your using 9 years when the stimulus is only for last year?

Ahhhhh....... What?

Texas avoided the real-estate bust that decimated the economies of several large Sunbelt states, including California and Florida, during the 2008-2010 recession. It consequently was positioned for a faster takeoff once the national economy began improving, allowing it to create 251,700 new jobs in the past year alone. These are private sector jobs!

You are the one who falsely stated that Texas used all stimulus money to create all Government jobs. Most of it in Texas went to cover a huge gap in Medicaid.

Are you avoiding what he did with the money on purpose!

No. This is what he did with it:

Texas has used $17.4 billion in federal stimulus money — including $8 billion of the one-time dollars to fund state expenses that recur over and over. In fact, Texas used the federal stimulus to balance its last two budgets.

You also avoided the fact that he has been creating more Government jobs than the entire Nation as a whole so what's up with that?

Because their population has increased rapidly. More than the rest of the nation. Now without stimulus money he is going to cut Government employees.

Texas, did not avoid real estate bubble. I know a builder in Dallas who had to rent out more than 50 spec houses. When I moved I lost 40 K on a 235 K home. The bubble was not as bad in Texas as other states, but perrywinkle had nothing to do with it.

Texas has used $17.4 billion in federal stimulus money — including $8 billion of the one-time dollars to fund state expenses that recur over and over. In fact, Texas used the federal stimulus to balance its last two budgets.

Wow Frying pan to fire. Money that was suppose to be used to create jobs and save jobs was used instead to balance the budget. So instead of putting people to work on repairs, upgrades, and new projects to get more people working he used the money to pay the extra Government workers.

Suuurrrrrreeeeeee he wants a smaller Government.

The US has a trade deficit, that means that the rest of the world is SUPPLYING to satisfy the demand in the US. The supply from the US is not competitive enough.

There is world demand out there. There are 6 billion consumers out there. The US has a trade deficit. The Indians and Chinese are able to find and satisfy consumers here. What is needed is competitiveness. With more competitiveness the US can get a trade surplus.
Competitiveness creates new demand for the US by taking it away from the rest of the world. Competitive companies GAIN market share from companies in other countries. Those US companies will have more demand in the US and around the world. Targeted tax credits for small and medium size companies help those companies become more competitive.

The big problem is that we aren't leading on any manufacturing. We could have been leading on Solar panels, wind turbines and other renewable energy production materiel, but we doubled down on Oil and coal instead.

Why? because the Coal and especially the Oil industry do not want clean energy to become a reality. Instead of looking at themselves as the Oil and Coal industry, they should begin to look at themselves as the "Energy Industry" and be willing to invest in different types of energy concepts. Regardless of the arguments, fossil fuel consumption is destroying our planet and by destroying our planet we are destroying ourselves....

who is barry?

Barry Sarturo, Barack Hussein Obama. Same guy i think, just not sure on the spelling of the first name, but you already knew that. Acting as if you dont isnt really cute if that was your intent.If not , then theres your answer.

Barry is tired of the 'ensure Barack Obama is a one term president' party obstructionism.

Why then will barrynot reach over and work with the GOP?

Just as valid a question is why didn't the Republicans reach across the aisle and allow the Obama jobs bill be debated and amended rather than refusing to even do that. The barrier between the two aisles is not a one way barrier where the Dems always have to do the reaching. It works both ways. In the past three years it has only worked one way thanks to the TP/GOP.

Why then will barrynot reach over and work with the GOP?

He has repeatedly. Again and again and again the GOP has sought to take political advantage and refuesed to work with him.

You do realize that conservatives have been against more things they have supported in the past with this President than any other? I thought I'd never see the day where the GOP would stand firmly against tax cuts.

The democrats are breaking the jobs bill in pieces, are the repubs breaking their bill in pieces too??

Thanks for the info.........

Give me a break mighty...If you count the record number of filibusters by the Teapublicans since Obama became President, the only choice he has is to take it to the people and let them decide what the definition of obstructionism is and how it has been propagated by a "do nothing party"....

It isnt a do nothing party, where would we be if every senator or house member just rolled over to what the President wanted? He is not the "King", he is an elected official just like all the others.

mighty- Why are you lying to yourself, about President Obama? You call him a "great divider" well this country has had 2 parties long before, Obama or you, or me were born. Did you think, just because this country has a Black President, the country would move to 1 party? Then you say he failed, why? what did he fail at? Let's see: April 1, 2009 tax cut for the middle-class... The Lily Leadbetter Law, equal pay for women....Expanded Pell Grants saved 60 billion(cut out the middle man)....Lifted the band on stem cell research....Healthier Lunch Program Law, it is the 1st major change in 30yr....American Recovery & Reinvestment Act, watch republicans, slamm-it on t.v. then go back to their districts and praise it.... Stopped 70+ billion in medicare fraud....New G.I. bill and repeal of DADT...Credit Card & tobacco reform.....Saved American Car Companies and 2million+ jobs....HealthCare for all your, nieces, nephews, cousins, aunts, uncles, half bros & sis all the people in YOUR family that don't have healthcare....Instead of the country bleeding jobs, by six figures every month, is has grown by 5.8%.....Seated 2 new supreme court justices, Sonia Sotomeyar, & Elaina Kegen..... American Borders have been beefed up by 45%....February 1, 2011 another tax break for small business......831 days Bin Laden is "DEAD".......mighty- Now you bring me some Bush accomplishments. O' my bad, you don't have any, because your HERO BUSH!! was the failure..........

Wow! Then why is the country in such bad shape and there are so many unhappy people. Like all of Obama's math it just doesn't add up.

Reflection. The Repubs are the dividers, always have been, always will be.

#17.4:Wow! Then why is the country in such bad shape and there are so many unhappy people. Like all of Obama's math it just doesn't add up.

Because that is what the republicans did when they were in office for the last 8 years! That's WHY!

There is absolutely nothing wrong with President Obama's math at all!

The people got mad this year after the repubs took charge of the house of reps and started to drive the economy into a great depression.

po sheep- It's call filibuster, obstruction, filibuster, obstruction, and dumb ass people voting against their own best interest..............O' yes the only reason dems are angry with President Obama, is because he didn't put his size 12's, in the republicans asses from day one..........

Life101 Do you have any facts from a reputable polling firm??? Keep ignoring the facts and keep going in the wrong direction.

Alex,

How can I support a bill that died in the senate. Our jobs are low and our company is out sourcing due to the economy. So lets have a party for the future job loss!....How can I support someone who does not support our efforts or is only looking for future votes.....

Everyone of YOU republicans have called President Obama everything but a shoe string, so why are you guys crying like little b(*^%$#, when you get your ass called out. If you can't take it, then don't dish it. By the way, you should have been depressed when you voted for Bush and dumb-ass McCain...........

Calm down, take another drink of kool aid and offer yourself as a sacrifice at the alter of the most corrupt President in U.S. history. The truth will come out!

Perry's wife is having the pity party, and they've just gotten started. Now that's funny.

#19.1:Everyone of YOU republicans have called President Obama everything but a shoe string, so why are you guys crying like little b(*^%$#, when you get your ass called out. If you can't take it, then don't dish it. By the way, you should have been depressed when you voted for Bush and dumb-ass McCain...........

Love it in ya! Keep up the good work friend.

19.2 - Maybe it's just me, but, this poster seems like a re-reg?

Odds are looking good, that you are correct, tink.

19.2 - Maybe it's just me, but, this poster seems like a re-reg?

You're probably correct, Tink. (I try not to use the word "right" unless I just have to; my way of showing lack of honor for those from that on the " wrong end" and are totally wrong-headed!)

You can usually go by the smell of things, i.e., same derogatory, using rhetorical themes, .e., kool-aid, inflammatory lies and non-truths throughout.

Typical rightist talking points that they have learned at the knee of one of their grandmasters, that stupid minion limmpaw!

po sheep- I don't know where you've been for the last 12 years, but "baby bush" was the worst President we have ever had, and I DIDN'T vote for him. I don't vote for liars & theives.....

I'm just wondering which Re-reg Troll you are?

I meant parts not part

Tony

WOW, I was wondering the same thing.

wow I guess you guess have nothing to say agianst what I said since you haven't made a real comment I win

Whoops an immediate insult instead of a defense. I just got closer to figuring out which one you are so care to try again.

By the way I happen to be tracking several articles so don't flatter yourself. However I now have an even better idea of who you are and it looks like you re-regged right after the last time I reported your butt in September.

your the one insulting instead instead of defending your opion and I didn't even have a newsvine account in September your just crazy

Well here is a hint because if I'm right your the same one who started with the same CoH violations of insults and then you even admitted to being a re-reg and you dared all of us to report you. Your words I believe where "go ahead and report me to Tyler I'll be back again".

Re-regs, as much fun as a hemmroidectomy.

or a uteran biopsy, oh wait the GOP have control of that now

Tony you are diffenitly insane I don't who mistook me for but I am not it and you are continusally viloting CoH I have any seen subtance in what you have I said

Hey Tony, you've got a good eye for spotting them, you got sheepie right away. Supporters is obviously one of the less educated ones judging by grammar and spelling. They are an insidious but dedicated group who I believe are trying to extract revenge for the banning of their beloved leader (who is still one of them re-regging on an almost daily basis). They've already driven Soph to take a time out and now they are and will be working on MWeaver.

Weaver, I apologize for going off topic somewhat but we need to mount some type of response to the Drifti fan club before they drive the decent posters away. I've read your thread on this problem and strongly agree with most of the comments. Maybe we need a new thread with Tyler and Sally actively participating with ideas to correct this problem.

Appreciate your vigilance, Miss Sally. Hope you're doing well.

Wow someone who listens to Rush Limbaugh calling the President a Bully.

it is called the rush/rove syndrom,

Sad, just sad :) :)

Yep your the same one alright. More insults and no substance. Gosh your making this easy.

I haven't seen any substance in your comments

I haven't seen any in yours either but then again insults and derailment comments never have any.

i missed the part where he said"I listen to Rush,and the president is a bully"?

Check the homepage. Some comments are word for word right outta his mouth.

It's about time Obama came out and defended himself. Funny, a repub can slander someone and it's free speech. When a dem defends himself, he's a bully. Bully-on Obama!

Tony there is plenty of subtance in post #22

Yea right. Pull the other leg it plays Motley Crew singing Smoking in the Boys room.

I have never heard Rush Limbaugh

Well, thats one way to keep sane, don't listen to him. Save yourself :)

I would just like to point the most probable reason for why rush limbaugh is crazy is he is just doing it for the radio I doubt he is actually that crazy

"They're all the same" isn't going to save the GOP come next November (though it might well splinter the GOP base, to the benefit of Democrats).

They're all the same will result in a continuation of GOP House majority as well as GOP regaining Senate majority. Most likely Obama will be reelected as the people of America have seen what electing one party to all three did not work.

A correction was made in 2010 and further correction in 2012 is most probable.

At #26.2 -- you're wrong son. If you were right, then the Republicans would have also taken control of the Senate in 2010, they didn't. They didn't because people were willing to experiment with Republicans...but that experiment has resulted in nothing but a stalled economy.

As an earlier poster on this thread said "the best campaigning is good governing".

December 2010 -- Economy growing at 3% adding 250,000 jobs.

Now, ten months after Republicans take control of the House of Representatives -- Economy STALLED.

That's precisely why the GOP is polling in the teens (while the President is still floating in the 40s...a higher polling than Ronald Reagan at this point in his Presidency, BTW).

I mean...I'm not trying to burst your bubble -- if you choose to coddle yourself with "got em' right where we want 'em!" -- be my guest, son.

Agree that the best campainging is good governing. Obama is obvioulsy not confident that his governance record is good enough for the American people to vote him into office again. Trying to raise 1,000,000,000 in campaign money is proof of that.

Ridiculous to say that the American voters would have elected the GOP to be the majority of both houses of Congress in 2010. America voted for a balanced government.

BTW, I am not your son so get off your self imposed pedestal.

Trying to raise 1,000,000,000 in campaign money is proof of that.

He's not "trying", he has (BTW, jealousy is the weakest emotion).

He's raised that amount for exactly the same reason George W. Bush was able to raise $450 Million to Al Gore's $250 Million -- people trust him more than his opposition.

BTW, stop acting like a child throwing a temper tantrum and people will stop confusing you with a kid.